Minnesota coyotes

[jaybic]

Hey guys,

I am just curious if anyone notices MN coyotes to be less vocal than their ND brothers. It seems I remember Coyotehunter saying someplace that he thought they were a different sub-species and I am wondering where I might go for more info on this(books, articles, research papers...ect...ect).

I know coyotehunter used to live in MN and it seems that howling around here(southeast MN) is all but useless. Just trying to figure out why that might be.

Any and all reasonable theories are welcome from anyone("they dont howl back cuz theyre all deaf in Minnesota"!....uuuuuhhhhh NO..ect).

Thanks guys,

jaybic

[lyonch]

minnesota coyotes are a sub species of coyote. Minnesota coyotes can be howled in and can howl. I can't remember what the sub species scientific name is but it was posted here by jamie at one time. The biggest thing i noticed about minnesota coyotes is the time i sit on stand. In north dakota they can usually make it there on a straight line and there in the open so they cover ground fast. In minnesota they seem to really walk around obstructions and come in a lot slower. Most minnesota coyote that i have called in come walking in. A lot of the north dakota coyotes either charge in a or trott in.

[wizbang]

Oh yeah-- big time differences. I've noticed this difference from the coyotes Randy Anderson and other more western callers shoot. The coyotes here in MN seem much less vocal-- especially during the day. In fact, I've never heard one during the daytime. They seem to be in that wierd transition between ND and the true Eastern coyotes. I've hunted in west central Wisconsin and they seem much more vocal-- but only at night. They'll answer challenge howls over there almost every time. I've never heard a MN coyote answer during the day and its almost impossible to howl one up. I feel your pain, jaybic.

[Tim Anderson]

When i go out at nite to locate they are pretty vocal. I use a couple different howlers and it seems they prefer one over the other. I've also used my WT since i bought it and they answer to it most times..
I also see the same responses as Lyonch...

[Coyotehunter]

Canis Latrans Thamos (brush wolf)

the Clever Coyote by Young/Jackson cover the 19 identified subspecies.

I think it has to do with the densities of coyotes in given areas. Night time is always the best time to locate 10pm-2am being some of the best times to locate. the lower the density the less apt they are to howl on there own. howling helps coyotes establish boundaries and where there neighbors are.

[jaybic]

Well, I have decided that MN coyotes are just plain stupid! Either that or they just dont know how the game is played.

I walked into a stand on Sunday morning 1/2 mi off the road, sun just coming up. Sneak in, sit down and put the foxpro out and let out 3 female invitation howls. A coyote off to my right comes up out of these little rolling hills about 400 yards away running away and stops at about 600 to look back. I give him a little bit of Critr call distress and off he goes, running away like his tail is on fire. Its experiences like this that make me want to believe that I should just give up on howling around here. He has obviously not read the istructions as to how this is all supposed to go down. Something like this:

He was supposed to howl back(to let me know he was there) and then I hit the distress(or challenge or what ever based on his howl back) and he comes in and gets himself killed at 70 yards but NOOOO.

I have no way of knowing but I am almost sure that if it were the ND variety coyote, he would have at least howled back or something and not just run away. I sure wish I knew more about why that is. I am starting to get it in my head that this is the normal reaction for a MN coyote that hears a howl. Run like hell and never look back(except at 600 yards and then keep running).

What a worthless state to live in for a die-hard coyote hunter. I understand why Coyotehunter moved! Its kinda like Marlin fishing in Nevada I think.

Sorry for the rant.

Jaybic

[lyonch]

Dont base your decision off of one coyote. You need to remember that someone else might have tried to howl that coyote in. In minnesota if your going to howl i have found that it is best done at night. I have yet to hear a minnesota coyote howl during the day, but never say never with a coyote

[Tim Anderson]

The Mn. coyotes tend to act differently through out the state. S-W Mn. the coyote act pretty much like a Dakota coyote and in most cases are eager to come to a call. The area north of Wilmar the coyotes respond pretty good as well . S-E there are some good areas they respond well in .. In my area they don't respond very well at all, i made over 150 stands through-out the year and finally had one come in dureing the month of june.. I have found that some of the coyotes spend the day time in a pipe or close to it or under some type of building or large brush piles.. Some coyotes are also bedding close to the roads so it makes it a little harder to sneak in on them without being seen or heard.. Just keep at it and sooner or later you may get a few to come in and when it happens enjoy the moument..LOL

[Coyotehunter]

I had a similar thing happen about a week ago and I am in Wyoming. I think he was coming in fine on the distress I had started with and I then blew out a howl. spotty snow and sage and I just did not see him coming. I did pick him up high tailing it out of there. I waited until he stopped and worked him back with some very quite and intermittant distress. took awhile to coax him into 200 yards. 40 minutes on stand. He spent about every step looking in every direction. I know everyone wants to howl but you just can't go wrong with a distress call. They got to eat. Could have been something as simple as a young coyote that had a bad experience the night before with another coyote. You probably did nothing wrong. coyote being coyote. There diffently is a time and place for howling but for the past 4 months all I have been doing it distress and even now very little howling. I still manage to kill a couple of coyotes even though I do not blow the full catalog of Randy Anderson Howls at every stand. Anyone heard of Les Johnson? Ask him how much Howling he does and I heard he is a pretty good coyote caller.

[Tim Anderson]

I met Les twice, once in AZ. and at the Varmint hunter jamberee. Les does rely on rabbit distress alot but i think ha does a little howling for locateing them...
_

[LeviM]

one thing I observed in MN, areas were they are ran hard by pickup and areas that are hit hard by people running them with dogs can be really tough to call coyotes, they are always on alert. Try calling under the moon light, they might let their gaurd down alittle more

[jaybic]

Hey fellas,

Around here it is hit very hard by the pickup crews and there are guys calling and educating them, thats for sure. I call pretty much every weekend both days late November( as soon as its legal to have rifles out) to end of Feb. Not counting 18 days calling ND so far this year, I have made maybe 50-75 stands and get maybe 3-5 a year down here in MN but it sure feels like a hell of a lot of effort for very minimal payoff. Maybe I am getting spoiled by those ND trips and seeing 50-60 coyotes in a 8-10 day hunt.

Its just funny how ya watch a video and they walk into a stand, sit down and call and wake one up and "oh look, here he comes" and around here you howl and one stands up that you couldnt see and its "oh look there he goes..fastern Dale Earnhardt the other way". Stinking coyotes anyway.

Funny that you mention culverts. I just lost my first ever spot and stalk coyote in a culvert. I made the mistake of not standing him up out of his bed and just shot him all curled up and hit him too far back and he made it to a culvert. I poked the rifle in there and killed him and spent the next 3 hours trying to get my "trophy" out of there with no luck. Stinking culverts anyway! I did learn a lesson tho, next time I do manage to put a successful stalk on a sleeping coyote, stand him up some how before you shoot. Who practices shooting at balled up coyotes anyway? DumbA$$ huh!.

Oh well, I guess it makes me appreciate my ND trips all the more.

Jaybic

[lyonch]

Every animal that i have shot sleeping i never woke up!! I have had the opportunity to miss a couple time and they just stand up and look to see what the hell just happened. then you get your second shot off. It does make sense to stand them up though to get that good shot placement.

[bucksnbears]

i've shot plenty sleeping but prefer to wake them with a sqeak so they lift there head then i can shoot em in the face. chris is right , if you dont wake them first and shoot and miss they will sometimes just stand up and lookaround. sometimes jump up and take off running but sometimes they will come towards you cuz they did'nt know where the shot came from. the bad thing about waking them first is if you do miss, they will know where you are and will run away from you.

[Dcoy]

Aim at the snowline-especially on fox.Hit bodies,not hair.They sink down pretty fast,pretty far.